Jiu-jitsu doesn't work unless you're an idiot!
by Nathan Joel on June 24, 2011

Interviewed after his victory at UFC 131, Dave Herman set the MMA chat-rooms ablaze by proclaiming Jiu-jitsu essentially ineffective: "I honestly really don't think [Jiu-jitsu] does [work]," Herman said. "If you have any knowledge at all of Jiu-jitsu, it's just not going to work. If you literally have never heard of anything and have no idea what they're doing, OK, kind of like the first UFC, yeah Jiu-jitsu works. It's kind of like trickery, basically. If you have any idea about any of the tricks, it's just not going to work, unless you're a complete idiot and fall for it." 

Is this true? Or just some Chael-Sonnen-style insults for the microphones?

For my part, I think Dave "Pee Wee" Herman is sincere, and believes what he is saying. To answer the question for myself I dug around for some data: 

In Pride events, roughly 30% of all fights ended in submissions, with KO/TKO getting about 35%, and the judges deciding the remaining fights (with the exception of a rare draw or no-contest.)

In the UFC, The Flyin'Hawaiian compiled the stats from UFC 31 (the first Zuffa PPV) through UFC 90 and discovered that out of 546 fights in the octagon, 138 ended by submission, 225 by KO/TKO, and rest going to the judges or ending in odd ways.

Obviously, the data doesn't lie. Jiu-jitsu works. (Note: these stats do not include the first 31 UFC events where BJJ stormed the combat sports community and even had Dana White and the Ferrita brothers wanting to train it.) Sure, Jiu-Jitsu is tricky; and of course BJJ practioners want you to "fall" for it. But every discipline in combat sports has feigns and misdirection as a foundational element, even Dave "Pee Wee" Herman's beloved wrestling. The thing is, as you all know, there are countermoves for everything, even for your countermoves. And arguing the pros and cons of different styles and disciplines is what makes MMA and sports in general so engrossing.

For example, I am currently enjoying an on-going argument with my Jiu-Jitsu coach* over a favorite ground and pound technique. Here goes: In the guard, on your knees, feign a guard pass by reaching back to unhook the top foot of your opponent, then throw a hard punch or elbow to the face from that loaded, coiled position. Lots of fighters run this technique. My coach, however, having an extremely fast triangle and a slick rubber-guard, is convinced it is dangerous and should not be risked against an opponent with a developed guard; because, if you reach your hand back there he is going to disrupt your base and get a Free New York or throw up a triangle fast! We go back and forth, arguing the benefits and risks. I love ground and pound, and believe in it. He loves Jiu-jitsu (traditional and 10th Planet), and believes in it. And debating the different philosophies is just, well, awesome! We both love this sport!

Of course, as anyone with sense can see, I am obviously right, and he is woefully wrong. Because, thanks to that one-man-think-tank Dave "Pee Wee" Herman, we now know that Jiu-jitsu just doesn't work (unless you are an idiot and fall for it.)

It is quite astonishing how many idiots we have in MMA. Tap, tap, tap...

*Jon Helton teaches at 10th Planet Charlotte

 |  (85) Comments IwishIwasMMA: BJJ is not as strong as it was. It is actually becoming weaker as time goes on now.. On a side note, it will eventually become strong again when wrestlers and BJJ practitioners start training in both from youth. So, the next generation or the generation after that will make it extremely strong again IMO. GO HARD: he's saying it very Chaelish.... but rite now BJJ is not as efffective. Guys are pretty well rounded and knowledgable of submission defense. still effective tho.. Lay'n'PrayNINJA: Team Quest trolling, nothing more. It worked on Nathan. :-) TGroves: Everyone trains Jiu-Jitsu now, so everyone knows what to look for. Jiu-Jitsu can certainly help you immensely, but it just isn't as effective as it has been in the past. Nathan Joel: Yes, it is true that the percentage of fighters ending in submissions is less, thus more people are aware of dangers. However, I believe the stats show that less fights are ending in KO/TKO too. More fights are going to the judges. Is standup less effective? I think everyone is getting better at everything. But, as far as Team Quest trolling, I needed an article idea. So, I am thankful they gave me one. These debates are fun. :) JujitsWho: Nog Hizoka: I think part of it is 1 year of learning sub defense can stop a guy that has 10 years of sub offense training... JujitsWho: I also think that BJJ guys are TOO comfortable on their backs in MMA matches. They've been trained to do that, so you can't blame them. They run into issues because most judges don't grasp what they are watching in the grappling department. It costs a lot of BJJ guys decisions. GO HARD: silva NEVER got worked by anyone ... BUT chael. and even that was strategized well by the Champ. but its whatever.... theres those that KNOW and those that DONT. shawnb: i did this math too ages ago, if you dont get a choke, submission are really really really rare nowadyas GO HARD: well if u feel that way, then u feel that way. i kinda see it differently. people cant relate to that robot of a character. just like its hard for them to relate to a guy that doesnt speak alot of english... Jon Jones popularity will be larger than both them dudes. People dont speak of GSP like they use to speak of Liddell. so i guess im not seeing him as the face for what Chuck was. flyangler: I agree with Herman on this, partially. Most MMA fighters at this level won't get caught in a submisson unless they are hurt and don't have all of their facilities. The guys that do get caught ARE idiots, see Chael Sonnen.
WHO WINS THE MAIN EVENT AT UFC 162 BETWEEN ANDERSON SILVA AND CHRIS WEIDMAN?
Silva via Decision
Silva via TKO/KO
Silva via Submission
Weidman via Decision
Weidman via TKO/KO
Weidman via Submission
TAKE ANOTHER POLL!